Water Softener…I know I need one, but I have Q's?
Here is my story.....
Ok so we bought our house about 3 months ago we right away noticed dishes arn't getting as clean and the water tastes a little different and we figured we had bad water. One Saturday morning I woke up to a nice cold shower becaues the calcium build-up on the elements shorted them out. I drained the hot water heater replaced the elements and the sediment in the bottom of the hot water heater was terrible I cleaned it out the best I could. So I now I know I have really hard water as we had the sellers replace the hot water elements a week before we moved in and it only took 3 months.
To my questions.....
I have no experience or a clue on what grain system to buy. It is just 2 adults averaging no more than 3000 gallons per month or less. I would like to get a system to withstand 2 adults and 2 children at least so lets say 6000 - 7000 gallons per month. How do I gauge on what size system I need?
I'm am mechanically inclined and my father is a plumber so I am not worried about the installation part.
Is it safe to drink/cook from the softener if I pipe the entire house through the softener?
At this point with all the terrible build up in the hot water heater I plan on getting a new hot water heater at the same time as a softener and redu all the piping at once because my 50 gallon hot water heater is probably 40 gallons from the sediment build-up I'm sure.
They advertise that the water softener can save money because the water is not as "thick" and will not use as much energy to heat in the hot water heater is this true? Has anyone noticed a difference? If for some reason its not good or you are not suppose to drink water from the softener what if I drank the water directly from my fridge which also has a filter would this then be fine?
Sorry I am new to the water softener stuff. We are also thinking if we have to spring the money for a new hot water heater to go with a on-demand hot water heater or "tank-less" anyone see any real savings with tankless heaters?
Thank you for your time.
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Tagged with: adults • bad water • calcium • clue • cold shower • dishes • fridge • grain system • hard water • hot water heater • money • one saturday • piping • plumber • saturday morning • sediment • tank • water elements • water softener
Filed under: Water Heating
Sounds as though you need one and they are great.
Check out a 30,000/36,000 grain, (Menards).
Problem: Only plumb it for all hot and ONLY the cold, (tub/shower, dishwasher, and washing machine), where you will NOT drink, (kitchen, bath faucets) or use on plants, (outside bibs/faucets).
Soft water is NOT for consumption or veggies/flowers..
A few things:
a) Tankless water heaters give large and continuous savings over conventional tank-type units.
b) Well-designed tankless heaters are less prone to calcification than conventional tank-types – but do require de-liming on occasion with very hard water applications – and that is a relatively simple process.
c) You are absolutely correct that it is not prudent to drink or cook with softened water. The calcium salts are replaced with sodium salts – not good. And at the same time, it is not good to water your plants or your garden with softened water as the salts will build up over time and kill them. The grounds of Carthage were salted by the romans over 2,000 years ago in an otherwise quite fertile area of North Africa – nothing grows there to this day. And large parts of Arizona and California are becoming infertile because salts from ground water irrigation are building up in the soil.
Ideally, you will have a softening system on only your hot-water system, and downstream of the softener. If you also run a cold-water line from this system to the clothes washer, & shower, you will also be able to wash your clothes in softened cold or warm water. Your dishwasher is 100% hot anyway. But your cooking water, hose bib outside and any potential potable water should be strictly unsoftened.
Before you do anything, get your water tested or buy a kit so that you can identify the exact grains of hardness you are dealing with and buy a softener that will handle your water challenges. Most softeners will also handle small amounts of iron and even smaller amounts of sulfur.
Your investment in a softener will greatly reduce the amount of calcium and magnesium that builds up in your appliances, but you will still need to flush your heater periodically to keep it in check.
Magnesium and calcium are stripped from the water through a process called ionization and theses minerals are actually good for us, they just are not good for our water appliances.
Many people will run a hard water tap to the kitchen sink and ice maker because they don’t care for the taste of soft water, though for every article that crucifies the drinking of soft water, there is one that says it is ok to drink.
Finally, do not invest in a tank-less water heater until you have resolved your water issues. If your water will plug up a 50 gallon tank, what do you suppose will happen to all of those little copper tubes? Our company installs Navien tank-less heaters and I will not sell one to someone on a well without a softener.
Good grief of course you can drink it. But best to not water the plants with it. http://www.doityourself.com/stry/softwater What softening the water does is it will allow your soap to lather better. You need less soap to wash clothing and shower and clean dishes. The build up on your hair and clothing will start to diminish in the interim get gallons of white vinegar and add to the dishwasher and the laundry…rinse your hair with it and spray down the shower with it full strength after each use. I have never heard that the water is thicker but the viscosity of the minerals that are inherent in the hard water makes that statement semi believable. Certainly clean pipes and a non compromised more energy efficient system will help here. Also check government rebates in the area for replacing your old one.
As far as tankless they are great for locations far from the heater for on demand hot water. Savings for the full tankless systems will take 15 years to offset the costs.
http://www.lenntech.com/processes/softening/faq/water-softener-faq.htm
Ok Tankless issue first:
Tankless water heaters do save money. They cost hundreds less a year in some locations and uses and many places have rebate programs that can save you money through your utility company, or similar agency.
If you get a direct vent tankless, mount it on an eternal wall. Otherwise get a power vent tankless. The reason for this it the direct vent is a double layer steel vent that cost a fortune. You have to buy the vent duct separately, and it starts at 150 dollars if you are mounting the tankless on the external wall. It can hit 600+ quick if away from the wall. Power vents can be made from anything, cheaper venting, but more expensive and larger water heater. .
If you don’t have a water softener, or an actual real water descaler, don’t get a tankless water heater. Don’t bother with a descaler, there are only a couple models that aren’t scams. They cost 4000 dollars. Typically used in areas where softeners are banned. An example: http://www.nextfiltration.com/next-ScaleStop.html
Also with your hard water you will have to do a vinegar flush of the tankless heater every 2 to 8 weeks depending on the speed of buildup. If you don’t the tankless will break due to the buildup. A flush is relatively cheap and takes 15 to 30 minutes minutes. That is assuming you have a water softener. If you don’t have a softener, don’t get a tankless water heater.
For the softener
You need to know how hard the water is. Have a sample of water tested. Then have a professional gauge the size for you.
Soft water is sodium rich but otherwise ok. Some say it tastes bad. If you have an issue with this install a Reverse Osmosis under sink water filter for your drinking and cooking water. The filter will remove much of the sodium.
Also if you get a tank based water heater you should flush it yearly with a recirculating pump and vinegar solution even with the water softener. It would be a good idea to do this with all the pipes in the house if you can yearly. It will preserve higher water pressure in the house.